RunnerDude Chats with Nick Symmonds

Over the years, I've been very fortunate in having opportunities to interview Olympic athletes. In 2012, I was able to interview Shalane Flanagan and Kara Goucher just before they headed to the London Games. Yesterday I had the opportunity to catch up with two-time Olympian, Nick Symmonds. 

Nick's first Olympic experience was at the 2008 Games in Beijing, the second taking place at the 2012 Games in London. Unfortunately, Nick was not able to make a third Olympics (Rio) due to an ankle injury just before the Games. In January, Nick announced he'd be retiring from competitive running after the 2017 outdoor season. It's been about 10 years since Nick turned pro and he's had an awesome career as a runner and his legacy will continue with his support of runners (and all endurance athletes) with his new product, Run Gum. Talking with Nick, I got to know a little more about this talented runner and outspoken advocate for athletes' rights. 

Take some time to check out the interview below to learn even more about this pretty cool Dude.

Interview with Two-Time Olympian Nick Symmonds

RunnerDude Chats with Shalane Flanagan and Kara Goucher

Recently, I got a call from a representative of Nissan's Innovation for Endurance program. He wanted to know if I'd be interested in interviewing 2012 U.S. Olympic team members Shalane Flanagan and Kara Goucher. Once I picked my jaw off the ground, I said, "HECK YEAH!"

Innovation for Endurance features exclusive, daily content showcasing the latest innovation in running, cycling, and general fitness. You probably recognize "SHIFT the way you move." from Nissan's current ad campaign. For Nissan, it means rethinking the ordinary, pushing the boundaries, exceeding expectations and anticipate the needs of an ever-changing planet. They urge you to "Make this the Year of Innovation."

Through the Innovation for Endurance community, Nissan brings you a whole new take on performance. They surface the best innovations in running, cycling, and fitness from across the country, and from their Nissan Innovators: record-breaking marathoner Ryan Hall; cycling champion Chris Horner and the cyclist of Team Radio Shack Nissan Trek; elite marathoners Kara Goucher and Shalane Flanagan; and world record-holding swimmer Ryan Lochte.

On Memorial Day, Kara and Shalane were in Boulder, Colorado, for the  BolderBoulder 10K event. They each took time out of their busy afternoon to do phone interviews with RunnerDude. I called, Kara and Shalane called me. I have to say, that picking up the phone and hearing, "Hi Thad, this is Shalane Flanagan." is pretty dang cool.

Below are my conversations with Kara and Shalane.

Kara Goucher Interview:
Bio: Kara won bronze at the 2007 World Championships at 10,000m. At the 2008 ING NYC Marathon, Kara made the fastest marathon debut ever for an American with her 2:25:53 third-place finish. This was also the first time in 14 years that an American placed in the top three at NYC. In 2009, she also placed third at the Boston Marathon in the women's race with 2:32:25. In 2010, Kara took time off for the birth of her son. In 2011, Kara returned to running with her second-fasted 10K time which qualified her for the 2011 World Team. At the Olympic Marathon Trials in Houston, she placed 3rd with 2:26:06 giving her a spot on the 2012 Olympic team.

RD: Congrats on making the U.S. Olympic Team in the marathon and thanks for taking the time to chat with me for a little while.
Kara: Yeah, thanks. No problem.
RD: I read an article you posted on Competitor.com and I loved the title, "Never Count Yourself Out." So many people take the easy way out by thinking, "well, it's just not meant to be", but you have a different philosophy on that. What helps you keep such a positive outlook?
Kara: Honesty, it's just a part of my makeup and the way I was raised, and I think most things are possible and you can achieve more than you think if you just keep at it. It's just the way I'm made.
RD: It's in your blood?
Kara: Yep, it's the way my mom raised me. It's the way that I am.
RD: Did you grow up in an athletic family?
Kara: I did grow up in an athletic family. My father was a soccer player. My mom was real active. They didn't have (women's) sports in her high school, they had cheerleading, so she did that. My sisters are very athletic. My older sister is a basketball, soccer, softball player and my little sister played basketball, soccer, and also ran.
RD: You mentioned in the article that at the Olympic Marathon Trials you experienced a huge wave of emotion come over your during the last 200m of the race when you realized you would be on your way to London. What was going through your mind as you finished that race?
Kara: It literally took my breath away as we made that final turn and I knew it was going to happen. I put my hand on my chest just to breathe and take it all in. It had been a very difficult year for me coming back from having my son was harder than I thought it was going to be. I also parted ways with my coach and then I had the first injury I've had in many years. So, it was a very difficult year and because of my injury, I started training for the Olympic trials so far behind everyone else and I knew it was going to be down to the wire to make the team. There were just so many people during that time that supported me and believed in me during that process and supported me to change coaches and to really seek out what I wanted. There were so many other people's investment in me that it was an overwhelming moment for me knowing what a difficult road it had been, but that it was going to happen.
RD: (toddler noises in the background) Is that your little one I hear in the background?
Kara: Yeah, that's Colt (laughing); we're trying to get him down for a nap, but he wants no part of it.

RD: How has motherhood and having a toddler around the house changed your training?
Kara: Yeah, I used to go do a hard workout and then come home and lay on the couch for the rest of the day and obviously that's not the same anymore. But he's actually helped me become more disciplined and scheduled in my running. Where I use to sleep until I woke up and then go for a run, now I'm up and out of bed by 6:30, 7:00AM and I'm running by 8:30AM. And the same in the afternoon. I'm starting my afternoon runs by 4:00PM so when I come back I have time to spend with Colt before I have to make dinner. He's definitely made me more disciplined, but I definitely don't rest as much as I used to.
RD: I can relate. We have three kids and I don't have all that training to do, and I still don't seem to get enough sleep. You, Shalane, and Desiree Davila are amazingly talented elite women marathoners. Some of the other countries also have strong contenders. Who do you see as your main competition?
Kara: The Olympics is an event where people tend to show up and run past their expectations. Really everyone is a threat. But, Liliya Shobukhova of Russia has been the most consistent marathoner in the last three years, so I'd have to say she's one of the favorites and I'd have to say the entire Kenyan and Ethiopian squad; I mean they're all sub 2:20 performers, so that's a time I haven't even come close to running. I'll definitely have my eye on all six of those women.
RD: You've mentioned the support that Shalane Flanagan has given you. What does it mean to you that you've both made the team?
Kara: It's great. I would not have made the Olympic team without Shalane. She pushed me in practice to a level that if I had been on my own, I just wouldn't have taken my self to those places. I've been injury free since then and we've been able to train together day in and day out and we've shared so much together over the last few months. I know how badly she wants to perform well and she knows how badly I want to perform well too. It's fun to be a part of each other's journey. And it will be nice to have a best friend there. That's very rare. We've gone through a lot together and going to the Olympics together is pretty special.
RD: You've talked a little about your training day. What is a typical training day like for you?
Kara: I'll meet my teammates at  8:30AM and if we have hard sessions, we'll do an hour warm-up before the hard session, then a cool-down. If it's a normal day, we'll run 90 minutes, then lift weights from 10:00-11:00AM, and then I'll go home. We'll usually finish up between 11:30 and 1:00PM, depending on how long the hard session was, and then I'll take a half-hour nap if Colt is still down. Whenever he's up, I'm up with him which is usually between 1:00 and 2:00PM. We have lunch together and then I hang out with him and then back to training again at 4:00PM until 5:00 or 5:30. Then I make dinner for my family and we have dinner together. I put Cold down for the night and then I have a few precious hours alone with my husband. I go to bed around 9:30 or 10:00 and then I do it all over again.
RD: That's a long day.
Kara: Yeah, a long day, but a fun day. It probably seems kind of boring, but it's rewarding. I know that I'm giving everything I have to the sport.
RD: You mentioned weight training. I'm a big believer in full-body resistance and core training for runners and use it in training my clients. What do you do during your daily weight training sessions?
Kara: Well, I have a weight coach and I just show up and he tells me what to do (laughing). He changes it up every day. Sometimes we lift weights. Other times we do core work like planks or we'll do yoga. Other days we'll use the Swiss ball, med balls, and/or the BOSU ball. And then there are other days where we skip rope and do ladder drills. It's all different. We try to hit the body in a different way ever day so we're constantly challenging the body.
RD: Are you superstitious in any way? Do you have lucky charms or rituals that you have to do before a big competition?
Kara: I used to be really superstitious with like what I ate...everything.... and then I started racing in Europe and with the level of competition I was up against and I kind of let a lot of my superstitions go. I did had these lucky barrettes and then they broke in half that last time I was at the World Champs. Most of my superstitions and lucky charms are gone by the wayside now. For me, now it's more about the night before reflecting on all the hard work I've done and reminding myself of all the hard work I've done to get to the point where I'm at and that's really it. I try to think about all the really hard sessions I endured.
RD: What's a typical pre- and/or post-fueling food that you like to use?
Kara: Oh, I'm partnered with Nutrilite, so I'll take one of their protein shakes within that 15-minute post workout window you hear so much about. When I get home I'll get a sandwich or a salad or leftovers from the night before. My diet's pretty...there's nothing really fancy about it, you know. I eat a lot of sandwiches, a lot of salads. At night I'll eat a lot of pasta, a lot of rice, pretty basic.
RD: Is there anything specific you eat before a workout or race?
Kara: The night before a long run, I'll have what I hope to have before the marathon which is like rice, chicken, sweet potatoes. Pretty bland. But other than that, I can pretty much eat what I want before a regular workout. Along with that I'll carbload with my electrolyte drink to just help prime the body and practice what I'll do as closely to race conditions as I can.
RD: What's something about yourself that people might find surprising?
Kara: I don't know (laughing), that's a tough question. I don't know (laughing). Sorry.
RD: (Laughing) No problem. Has being on an Olympic team always been a dream of yours?
Kara: It's always been a dream to be an Olympian. I've watched the Olympics since a very young age. My family was always into the Olympics. So, I always wanted to be an Olympian, but I was never particularly good at anything in sports. So I'd watch the Olympic gymnastics and I'd say, "I want to go to the Olympics in gymnastics" and then I was a terrible gymnast. So then I'd say, "Well may be I'll go to the Olympics in swimming." I was a terrible swimmer. I always wanted to be an Olympian, but it wasn't until high school when I really started running and had some success right away that I began to flirt with the idea. Then I went to college and realized just how many people there were just as good as I was, so it seemed so far away at that point. Then towards the end of college I started to dream about it again. Then I went professional and realized yet again just how far away I was again. In 2006 I started running times that were competitive on the world level and that's when I started to want to make that dream happen. Then I went to the Olympics in 2008 and was kind of overwhelmed by the whole experience. The minute I came home from Beijing, all I could think about was going back and enjoying it and doing it right.
RD: What kind of advice would you give young aspiring runners, particularly young girls?
Kara: Just that running is something you can do forever. I started running when I was 12 and I'm almost 34 and I've just gotten better and better every year. Have a lot of patience with it and it will be there potentially your entire life if you don't try to rush it. So many times in life we want everything right away, but running is a journey that you can take for years and years to come. Just remember that when I was 18, I thought I was never going to get any better and here I am almost 34 and keep getting better.
RD: Is there anything else you'd like to share?
Kara: Yeah, I'm here at the BolderBoulder talking with people from all over and it never ceases to amaze me how many lives running has touched and I think it's really cool. I'm a big believer that you don't have to be an elite runner, you don't even have to run every day, but if you get out and run every once in a while, you're a part of the club. It's just so fun to be around all the people who are a part of the club.

Shalane Flanagan Interview:
Bio: Like RunnerDude, Shalane is a UNC-Chapel Hill grad. While there she won two NCAA cross country titles and qualified for the 2004 U.S. Olympic team at 5000m. She won a bronze medal in the 10,000 meters at the 2008 Olympic Games. Shalane is the current American record-holder at 5,000 and 10,000 meters and will represent the US in the 2012 Olympic Marathon (Shalane set an Olympic Trials record of 2:25:38 in only her second marathon.)

RD: First of all, congratulations on making the U.S. Olympic team. It's an amazing honor and achievement to make it to the Olympics. This will make your 3rd Olympics. What does it mean to you to be returning a 3rd time.
Shalane: It's amazing. I'm very fortunate. I went to Athens right out of the University of North Carolina and then of course Beijing was obviously very special. I just think I've learned so much from both of them. So, I'm coming with a a lot of sense and purpose to this third Olympics. It's going to be fitting, because I'm not on the track anymore, it's like a whole new event. It's an exciting time to be a marathoner in the Olympics.
RD: I've followed your running career since Carolina and I was so excited to see you transition to the marathon distance. That's my race distance of choice. What do you like about the marathon as compared to the other distances you've competed in?
Shalane: Yeah, well you just kind of gave an example, the marathon's not as exclusive as track. I get to run on the same course as everyone on the same day, so I get to share the experience with 1000s of people. We all take the same steps over the same course. To be able to share that, it's just a different niche. I think what I love the most about marathons, is that I get to share it with so many people, but more than that, I love the training, actually. I love the fatigue and the commitment it takes to be a marathoner. Just the lifestyle. It's a great club to be a part of.
RD: Talk some about your training. What's a typical training day like for you?
Shalane: It's pretty much running twice a day almost every day, except on days where I run 20 miles or more. Like yesterday was a luxurious day because Kara (Goucher) and I had 22 miles and then we hopped on a flight and came to Boulder. We only had to run once, so (laughing) today we were actually up running at 6AM and actually as soon as I finish talking with you I'm going t head out and sneak in a little 30-minute run before catching my flight home. Yeah, it's just consistent training, lots of running and we're getting into the meat and potatoes of our marathon specific training so that's geared for getting faster and sharper and kind of nailing down that marathon pace.
RD: Where do you do most of your training?
Shalane: I'm in Portland, Oregon. The Nike campus is a huge place where we all meet up and run. There's a 2-mile loop a wood chip trail around the campus and then there's a track and some grass fields we run on. So we run there a lot and then there are a lot of trails in downtown Portland and the waterfront. There's not a huge variety, but it's really consistent and good for our training needs.
RD: You mentioned Kara Goucher. I know you guys are really good friends. What's it mean to you that you'll both be representing the U.S. in the Olympic Marathon?
Shalane: Yeah, I think we're in a really unique position. There's not really many elite women in the world that train together like we do at this level and we have the same goals and we both want the same things. It's great to have that accountability and someone to push you on an everyday basis to get the most out of you. And, we just have a fun time. I've never enjoyed my running more than now being able to share the process and the journey with someone.
RD: You, Kara, and Desiree Davila are amazingly talented elite women marathoners. Some of the other countries also have strong contenders. Who do you see as your main competition?
Shalane: That's the beauty of the Olympics. Going into it, on paper, you could say that so-n-so is the favorite, but it's amazing how many times the favorites don't win or don't medal in the Olympics. It's an amazing race. It's whoever shows up healthy and hungry on that day. Because the marathon is so long there are a lot of unpredictable things that can go wrong. But, on paper, as of right now the Kenyan team looks the strongest. they have three women that have run under 2:20 for a marathon and who are consistently really good. Some of the Ethiopians look good, some Russians, Chinese, and Japanese are looking good too. But the beauty is that in the marathon anything can happen. I think Kara and I have a really good shot at being really competitive to the very end, so that's very exciting.
RD: You're planning to do the trials for the 10K too, right?
Shalane: Yeah
RD: That's right around the corner at the end of June, isn't it?
Shalane: Yep, it's like June 22nd, so coming up fast.
RD: How's that coming, your preparation for that race?
Shalane: Um, well, it's not necessarily the focus at all. I'm just looking at it as a good fitness test. A good hard run. What I can do that night, I'm not sure. I know I'm fit. I have a training partner, Lisa Koll, well actually her name is Uhl now. She got married, but she's one of the top 10K runners right now going into the trials. So, I know if I can stick close to her in the workouts and I know what she's been doing then I know I can be competitive. The beauty is that I don't have any pressure. I can go in race hard and there's no consequence to it. I already have my slot to London, so I can pretty much run hard and have fun.
RD: As far as food goes, is there anything specific you eat pre or post workout?
Shalane: Yeah, so I'm actually sponsored by Gatorade and I went to the lab this past fall to fine tune my nutrition and learn how to hydrate during the marathon. We did a whole sweat analysis and all this other stuff to see what kind of sweater I was. At the trials I used a regular Gatorade product, but now I'm training with a Gatorade Endurance product that has more electrolytes and sodium and I've found that it absorbs in my stomach really well and I don't get like a sloshy stomach. That's been a huge...that's one of the variables that's really been nerve racking to me...how to consume fluids while running. It was such a foreign concept to me. Gatorade's been huge in helping me with that. I had no idea where to begin and how to do it. I think a huge part of being successful on the day of the marathon is fueling yourself. If you don't do that right, that's one piece of the puzzle that can potentially go wrong. And for pre-workout and pre-race eating, I'm a pretty bland eater. I keep it simple with a lot of carbs and a little protein here and there. After my workouts, I either do protein shakes or eat eggs. I kind of eat a lot of eggs right after workouts.
RD: Are you superstitious in any way? Do you have lucky charms or rituals that you have to do before a big competition?
Shalane: The only thing that's kind of superstitious or good luck is if in my bib there's a number 8. That's my lucky number. So, if I get a bib with an 8 in it, I think "Oh my god, this is great! I'm going to rock this!" (laughing).
RD: You grew up in a pretty athletic family. When did you actually get into running?
Shalane: Yep, both my parents were runners. My mom (Cheryl Bridges Treworgy) actually had a world record in a marathon (1971) and was a U.S. World Cross Country Championship 5-Time participant. My Dad ran for UCONN and my mom ran for Indiana State, so I definitely come from a running background. I grew up in Boulder, Colorado and at the time was a kind of a running hot spot. I was always aware of running, but I didn't really fall in love with it until like high school. I kind of feel it was my calling and my passion, but growing up, I just thought, "Oh everyone runs." So, it was a natural thing, but I didn't really get into it until high school.
RD: Was being an Olympian always a goal in the back of your mind or did that just kind of fall into place as your running career developed?
Shalane: Yeah, I think any Olympic type sport, the Olympics is the pinnacle and that stage is the best stage to perform on. So, yeah, fully aware of the Olympics and many role models and inspiration came from watching the Olympic Games as I grew up. Even in my high school year book (when you write those prophecies of yourself) I wrote "Olympics." So, it was definitely on my mind at a young age.
RD: Is there something about yourself that people might find surprising?

Shalane: Yeah, I'm totally obsessed with my cat Boo. I don't have any kids yet, so she is my child. She's a North Carolina kitty. I got her right after graduating from college. Totally in love with her. I also really like art and hope to one day get back into it. I was in an art major program in high school and did all sorts of media. So, that one's side thing I'm into that's nonathletic.
RD: Is there a particular art media that you're drawn to?
Shalane: Yeah, I enjoyed doing a lot of pottery and working with clay, but I also really enjoy painting.
RD: Of all the races you've done is there any one that's more memorable that really stands out for you?
Shalane: I've been fortunate to have had a lot of good races, but as far as butterflies and the excitement I think my first Olympic team is pretty special. Coming out of Carolina, I was not expected to make the team, but I fought and clawed my way onto it and I think that was one of the greatest races in my life. I think that was a big stepping stone to my current presence as a U.S. distance runner. That was, I think, what gave me the confidence to get me where I am today.
RD: Along the way, has there been anyone, a coach or a family member that's been a role model or inspiration for you in your development as a runner?
Shalane: Gosh, I could list lots of people. I've had specific role models within the sport each step of the way. Basically, it's like a culmination of all the people from my high school coach to my college coach. Everyone's contributed in their own little way to making me the runner that I am. I think most importantly  parents play the most instrumental role in fostering kids and their dreams at an early age and letting it grow from there.
RD: Do you have any words of wisdom for youngsters aspiring to become runners, especially young girls?
Shalane: Yeah, definitely. I think it takes a lot of self-belief. I think what's great about athletics especially for young women is the self-esteem it builds. Just keep driving on that. As a child in elementary school, I would beat all the boys in the physical fitness tests and that just really built my self-esteem and it was great to feel really good about yourself. Keep believing in yourself and surround yourself with people that want to help you achieve your goals and dreams.

A big thank's to the  Nissan's Innovation for Endurance program for making the interviews possible and a huge thanks to Kara and Shalane for taking the time to share a little about themselves with the readers of RunnerDude's Blog. The entire RunnerDude Family will be rooting for you both at London! Best of Luck!

RunnerDude Chats with Danny Dreyer

Long before barefoot running became the latest thing for runners, long before the terms "forefoot" and "midfoot running, there was a movement for a more effortless, injury-free way of running. What was this movement that's still going strong today? Chi Running, founded by Danny Dreyer in the late 90s. Several years ago, I purchased a copy of Danny's book, Chi Running, and that was the first time I really began thinking more about the mind-body connection of running as well as proper alignment of your body when running. I began implementing many of the key components of Chi Running in my own running and found them to be very helpful.

Over the years, my copy of Chi Running has become a bit tattered. I've referred to it often and even more so now that I'm training/coaching runners. I was so delighted to discover that Danny lives just a few hours west of me in Asheville, NC. Being so close, I had to contact Mr. Dreyer to see if he'd let me treat him to lunch and pick his brain about Chi Running, running in general, and where running's headed in the future. To my delight, he accepted. So, at the end of January (one one the coldest days ever), I headed west to the NC mountains.

It had been several years since I'd visited Asheville and I had forgotten how beautiful that area of the state is. The larger snow capped mountains were evidence of a snowfall Asheville had experienced the prior week. Danny gave me great directions and I had no problem locating the turn-of-the century two-story building Danny and his wife renovated for the new home of Chi Living. I love older homes and buildings, and immediately became enthralled with all the details of this charming old structure as I ascended the wooden steps to the front door. Since it was a business and not a home, I wasnt' sure if I should knock or walk right in. I opted to just open the door to which I was immediately greeted by a large happy dog soon followed by one of Danny's employees who greeted me with a big smile and promptly took me to meet Danny.

Danny is in his early 60s but looks closer to someone in his early 40s. Just a little taller than me and wearing relaxed casual clothes, I knew I was going to like Danny from the get go. (I think, maybe, I own one tie and one sport coat, although I'd be hard pressed to find them if I needed to quickly.) Danny finished up a call and gave me a wonderful greeting and made me feel right at home. He grabbed his coat and said there was a great eatery called Pack's Tavern a few blocks down where we could do the interview. It was a beautiful day with a bright, clear blue sky, but it was about 17 degrees and windy. Quite a bit colder than Greensboro where I live. Danny grabbed a nice warm coat and I had my thin fleece pullover. Didn't really matter. I was numb before we left Chi Living. I couldn't believe I was heading out the door about to eat lunch with the founder of Chi Running. How cool was that!

The restaurant was a large eclectic turn-of the-century brick building with a rich history. Built in 1907, it's been a lumber supplier, automotive supplier, as well as a popular spot for barbecue and bluegrass. It's one of those rare gems with exposed interior brick and wooded beams, wooden plank floors that creak, and large windows that filled the space with lots of sunlight. I warmed up quickly.

While we were seated and our drink orders taken, I thought about the list of questions I had prepared to ask Danny. I decided that instead of a formal interview, what I really wanted to do was just have a rich conversation with Danny about Chi Running as well as get to know more about this innovative thinker sitting across from me.

I asked Danny if he had always been a runner. He responded, "No" with a laugh. He explained the chuckle by sharing that when he was young he was at an inner-city high school flooded with running talent and he was a bit intimidated by that caliber of runner. At that time he had a hard time seeing himself running long, even short spans of time. He did like to ski and so joined the ski club in school. Danny's an avid skier today.

Later during lunch, I asked Danny if there was something about him that may surprise his followers. He responded, "I like skiing better than running." Then he laughed and said, "Don't get me wrong. I love running, but I do it every day. Skiing doesn't happen as often, so I really cherish and enjoy when I get to ski." You may also be surprised to know that Danny was a woodworker before turning full time to coaching running. His wife was transitioning in her career and Danny's hearing was suffering from the machinery used in woodworking. Around this same time his coaching methods were really taking off in California and they felt that they had enough initial success to turn to the coaching and Chi Running into their new career. I'm so glad they made that decision.

Danny continued to explain that even in his early 20s he never ran, that is until he was drafted into the Army. It was 1971 and it was a stressful time, not to mention just the physical stress of boot camp. He began running around the base, not only to help him get into shape, but he discovered that it helped him relax and relieve himself of some of the mental stress he was under. It was during that time, that  he discovered his love for running and he was delighted that it wasn't all for the physical benefits either.

I had read in Danny's book, Chi Running that as a child he was extremely curious about how things worked. He was always taking things apart to see how they worked. I asked him if this intrinsic curiosity played any part in his development of Chi Running. He agreed that it did play a big part. He said that around the same time he was learning to love running both for the physical and mental benefits, he was also beginning to practice meditation. With his teacher from India, he learned techniques that helped him quiet his mind so he could listen to his body. The two, running and meditation, began to become intertwined. This stirred Danny's curiosity into how the physics of running were affected by the "energies powering it." And this began Danny's quest into discovering the best way to move your body using mental focus and relaxation instead of muscle power...the roots of Chi Running.

For about 20 years Danny tinkered with this mind-body connection, but it wasn't until the late 90s that he really began to put it all together. It happened while studying T'ai Chi with the great Chinese T'ai Chi master, Zhu Xilin. Through Zhu Xilin, Danny learned about the concept of moving from your center and letting your arms and legs follow. Danny shared that T'ai Chi teaches you to direct movement from your spine, so that the movement begins with the center of your body instead of from the periphery. He said it's kind of like a tree's strength coming from it's trunk not the branches. Danny shared  how this center source of power really intrigued him and his natural curiosity made him wonder how this could be applied to running. He described it as "moving the body from its center and letting your legs be pulled along for the ride." He tinkered with this new way of thinking about running and soon discovered that he wasn't working as hard to achieve the same outcomes. He also wasn't as worn out or sore after his runs.

After a move from Colorado to San Francisco, Danny found a new teacher, Master Xu. His new teacher, had a theory that the principles of T'ai Chi could be applied to any sport. Working with Master Xu helped Danny synthesize what he'd learned about T'ai Chi and what he knew about running. Danny explained that in T'ai Chi, your legs are your base, your spine is your source of power and the energy flows from the spine out of your upper body through the movements. Danny took that principle and flipped it. He explained that in Chi Running, your upper body is your base, the spine is still your center of energy, but the energy flows from your center through your legs. It's kind of like T'ai Chi flipped.

Not only is Chi Running about energy resonating from your center, a strong mind-body connection, a spiritual connection, and relaxation, there's are also an important component of alignment and posture. In the revised edition of Chi Running, Danny devotes a good portion of the book to pelvic tilt and how finding that "sweet spot" of your pelvic tilt will add years to your running, improve your overall posture, keep your hips and lower back healthy, and avoid IT band issues. Danny also talked about the importance of pelvic rotation. He said that westerners (especially men) are very tight in the pelvic region allowing very little movement. Everything is pretty much a front-to-back motion, very little rotation or lateral movement. In most other cultures, there is much more movement in the hips providing much better range of motion and actually a healthier longer stride. Check out this great video blog from Danny on posture.

Chi Running allows you as a runner to use the physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual to your advantage in a way that helps you work with and cooperate with the force of the road instead of the road being your enemy. Danny drew a cool diagram of how just the physics of a midfoot strike, landing underneath or actually slightly behind your body all work with the road instead of fighting it. Danny sketched out some other drawings to help explain his theories. Looking at them without he explanation, they may not seem to say much, but basically they're showing how Chi Running helps the old cliche of "becoming one with the road" not so much of an old cliche. You really can become one with the road instead of fighting it.

I asked Danny what was the best way to get into Chi Running. He said that actually beginning with Chi Walking is best. Through Chi Walking, you'll learn all the basic principles and techniques used in Chi Running, but it's at a slower pace so you can work on and master the techniques before increasing your pace to one of running. In his clinics for Chi Running, the participants actually begin with learning Chi Walking. It's a great foundation from which to begin.

One of the things I like about Danny, is that he not only practices what he preaches, he lives what he preaches. He's been using the techniques of Chi Running for over 20 years and has a life of experiences to stand behind his teachings. Just to make sure this wasn't something unique to Danny, he surveyed thousands of Chi Running customers. 95% said their running had improved. 91% feel Chi Running has played a role in preventing running injuries. 90% said they were probably or definitely able to change their running mechanics with Chi Running. 61% said they were a heel-striker before practicing Chi Running, and 71% said they were a midfoot striker after practicing Chi Running. 60% said they were able to make noticeable corrections in less than a month, 31% said immediately. This was just a sampling of the positive feedback provided by the survey. Now more science is underway to further biomechanical studies of Chi Running technique.

Danny is quite an accomplished runner himself. He prefers the longer distances and has done quite well in ultras. He ran his first race back in 1995 (a 50-miler). He's completed 40 ultramarathons since then. He's won his age group in 14 of those races and placed in the top three in his age group in all but three of those races. Danny's run 50Ks, 50-milers, 100Ks, and 100-milers. He ran his first marathon (Big Sur) in 2002, winning his age group with a 3:04. Danny's quick to say though that Chi Running isn't just a technique for long distance runners. He strongly believes that it's for any runner, novice to elite.

I asked Danny, if he had a particular type or brand of shoe he preferred. While not a barefoot runner, he does prefer more of a minimalist shoe. He said the new "high-tech" minimalist shoes are fine, but a good pair of racing flats will often work just as well. He said he wished Nike still made those original racing flats from way back. Danny did say that Newton sent him a pair of their shoes to give a try and he did set a PR running in them.

We talked for about and hour and a half and I was completely enthralled with the conversation. To hear Danny explain Chi Running, it really does all make sense. Whether or not you become a Chi Runner, reading Chi Running, is a wonderful exploration of your own running and I bet you come away applying many of the techniques.


Danny's Staff at Chi Living


I asked Danny what should we expect next from Chi Running. He was excited to share that he's currently working on a book about how to run a pain-free marathon. I've been sworn to secrecy, but from what I know about the book, it's going to appeal to many runners. You'll definitley find a review of the book on RunnerDude's Blog shortly after the book is released. Danny was also excited about revisions made to the Chi Running website http://www.chirunning.com/. After I returned home, I spent some time going through the website and they've done an excellent job. Be sure to check it out. You can also access the Chi Walking and Chi Living websites from the same link.

I'm so motivated and inspired by my talk with Danny, that my goal is to become a certified Chi Running instructor. Hopefully that will all come to be this summer. You guys hold me accountable and check in with me next fall to see if I've achieved my goal.

Thanks again to Danny and his staff at Chi Living for making this lunch an interview possible. To learn more about Chi Running, check out the video clip below from Danny.

RunnerDude Chats with Chuck "MarathonJunkie" Engle

Ahh the marathon. It's my favorite distance to race. If you're a marathon runner, non runners think your nuts, even some seasoned shorter-distance runners think you're nuts. But, there's nothing quite like experiencing that first marathon. I was so overwhelmed with exhaustion and emotion after finishing my first marathon (NYC '97) that I cried. Actually it was a sob. Not ashamed one iota. I earned that sob. Once you experience that thrill, you want to experience it again and again.

Chuck Engle, has taken that "experiencing it again and again" to a whole new level. Nicknamed "MarathonJunkie", Chuck has just recently experienced his 100th and 101st marathon wins. Not, marathon completions, but marathon WINS! I've followed Chuck's racing over the years and when he participated in the 2010 NC Marathon in High Point, NC (just a town away from me), I became an even more avid fan. You see, Chuck overslept the night before that race and ended up leaving Columbus, OH and driving 8 hours to High Point, NC just barely making the 8AM start time. He even got a speeding ticket on the way, but somehow he still managed to run a great race, taking first place!

Recently I had the wonderful opportunity to interview Chuck and learn more about this marathon machine, I mean "junkie." Read on to learn more about this amazing runner.

RD: I see you’re in Dublin, OH. Are you originally from there? Where did you grow up?
Chuck: Born in Grant Hospital in Columbus, Ohio. Spent my formative years at Cloverleaf High School in Lodi, Ohio running for Coach Todd Clark.

RD: How long has running been a part of your life? Did you grow up in a sports oriented family?
Chuck: Running was something I started doing to stay in shape for wrestling. I began wrestling in elementary school and running was always a part of building endurance. My family did their own things. My older brother played football, ran hurdles and sprints in track and wrestled. My older sister ran sprints and my younger sister was a pole vaulter. No one does much of any regular athletics these days.

RD: What got you into running?
Chuck: I credit a guy by the name of J.D. Skrant for getting me hooked at first. Mr. Skrant was an assistant coach in my junior high school and asked me to give cross country a try in my eighth grade year. It was the influence of my high school coach, Todd Clark, that propelled me further into running and provided much of the foundation for my success and my personal running philosophies.

RD: You work as a web programmer for one of my favorite websites, MarathonGuide.com. I think your official title is Marathon Junkie/Public Relations. Here’s a chicken/egg question for you. Which came first? Did you go to MarathonGuide.com because of your running? Or did this running persona spring forth after coming to work for MarathonGuide.com?
Chuck: The running persona sprang forth from an interview in 2003 with an Omaha World reporter who coined the phrase that I was "a veritable marathonjunkie" after I completed 29 marathons in 2003. The title stuck as there were no other runners competing in as many marathons and running them as fast as I had done that year.

RD: You ran 44 marathons in 2009 and won over half of them. That’s almost one marathon every weekend throughout the year. What motivates you to keep going?
Chuck: I really enjoy the traveling that goes along with my running. The other part of running is the social aspect. My running family is close to me. Most of my closest friends are those who I have met during marathon races. Winning is merely a matter of who shows up on any given day. I have gone to races with as few as 17 people and been beaten by runners who were just passing through on vacation. And I have done races as big as 5,000 where I just happened to be the fastest runner on the course that day. Granted it does take hard work to run under 2:40 in a marathon, but winning any given day takes a certain amount of luck.

RD: Man with the 44 marathons alone, you logged 1,152.8 miles. How many miles total did you log in ’09? How many have you logged so far in 2010?
Chuck: I think I put in nearly 3,000 miles in 2009 with training and recovery miles included. 2010 saw a reduction as I took a bit of a break in the early part of the year.

RD: Are you going to break 44 marathons this year?
Chuck: My record for 365 consecutive days is 54 marathons. I would like to take a shot at running more than that. It's not the running that is the tough part. It has been the monetary side of things. I have heard a lot of people call themselves "extreme" for doing 50 or more marathons in a year. But guys like Sam Thompson ran 51 in 50 days. That is extreme. Those that travel to 50 or more in a single year are merely good at being a travel agent and nothing more. Most anyone can run 50 marathons in a year. It is merely a matter of planning and logistics.

RD: With that many marathons you must go through a ton of shoes. Good thing MarathonGuide.com is your sponsor. About how many pairs of trainers do you run through in a year? Racing flats?
Chuck: MarathonguideMoines in 2002 and I have had some incredible experiences thanks to my sponsors including Marathonguide.com. The shoes are part of a Nike sponsorship. I have been running in Nike shoes since 1985 and I thank Nike and Second Sole Ohio for their continued support as I trash one pair of Nike Vomeros per month and one pair of racing flats per month. My racing flats are currently Nike Lunar Racers. The new generations comes out in January and I am really excited to give them a go.

RD: What do you enjoy most about running? Is it the mental? Physical? Both?
Chuck: The mental side of running is mostly conquered. I can nearly always predict, based on training, mileage and nutrition, what kind of time I will run in any given marathon. What I enjoy most is seeing so many friends on the course and of course hanging out with good friends post race. Some of my best marathon memories have been post race with friends like Matt Manning of Kansas, The Little Rock Arkansas Crew, The Nashville Flying Monkey Crew and of course Jeff and Linda Venable from Texas.

RD: What do you think about when you’re racing? Is it all focused on strategy and racing, or does your body go on auto pilot and you find yourself thinking about other things?

Chuck: Depending on the race I am either calculating splits and finish time along the course. There have been races where I am just trying to hurt and push as long as I can and I do, in a somewhat sick way, like to blow up in a race from time to time. There is a rush unlike any other I have had when your body can no longer respond to what my brain is telling it to do. That is a limit that I love to find and try to push beyond. I think it is more interesting as to what the subconscious goes through when racing at a high heart rate level. The myriad of thoughts that come rushing into my conscious when I am finished racing are almost certainly due to the brain going into over time during two and a half hours of racing.

RD: You ran your first marathon back in 2000. Was that the race that hooked you, or did it take a few more before you decided this was “your” race?
Chuck: Tupelo will always be the race that hooked me. Mike Lail was the race director at that time and he was as shocked as I was when I crossed the finish line in 2 hours and 34 minutes. It was a hot day and I loved the total feeling of exhaustion. Mike Lail was there for me. He showed me that it is the people involved in the race that make all marathons more than just 26.2 miles. My experience at Tupelo every year I have done it, is one of the reasons I keep running. I love to find races like that with people like that. In this day and age of big time marathons with exorbitant entry fees and high dollar entertainment, races like Tupelo, Little Rock, Grand Rapids, Lake Placid, Flying Monkey and a handful of others stand apart.

RD: Since you’re a “marathon junkie” there must be an addiction in there somewhere. Is that addiction for the distance, the race, the crowd, the competition, the record-breaking, or all or some of the aforementioned?
Chuck: People who have never "won" don't know what they are missing. I like to win. But as mentioned before, you just never know who will show up any given day. That is a thrill for me. Thinking I could win a race in Dayton Ohio only to finish second to Josh Cox by more than ten minutes was a complete rush. I was the most fit for any race I had been and I wanted to win badly. Josh showed up and qualified for the Olympic Trials. I was crushed with second place, but elated that Josh had led me to a new PR. The addiction is and will always be to push my body to the breaking point and when it breaks, how much further can my mind take it. I set goals beyond just finishing races or running 52 in a year. For me it's about my personal race. I know how healthy I am at any given race and I like racing sick or injured or after two marathons in the previous two days. Racing...putting my heart rate up there as high as I think it will go without my heart exploding. Then, in specific races, seeing if my heart will pop before my brain says quit. That's the addiction. That's how I like to run.... on my personal edge. It's not about bragging to the world that I finished a billion races in one year. All I need to have to do that is money and a good travel agent. I will stick to running as fast as I can in any given circumstance. Take what the day gives me and run hard. The marathon deserves that much.

RD: Speaking of records, you have quite a few—the most sub 3-hour marathons in the world; #1 and #2 fastest 50 back to back official marathons; the fastest average for 52 consecutive marathon weekends (October 2008 - October 2009); the most consecutive U.S. marathon victories with 7 in 7 weekends in which you set 7 course records in each race (2006); running 3 days of sub 3 official marathons twice; winning back-to-back Saturday and Sunday marathons twice. Man, I’m pooped just listing them all. Those are some awesome accomplishments. I’m sure you’re extremely proud of them all, but is one more special to you than the others?
Chuck: I am reminded by others about these records. At this point in my life, I just want to RUN MORE! I don't want to spend time counting things when I could be putting in more mileage. People count things when the are finished and want to reminisce. I will admit, however, that when I won my 100th marathon race and popped a can of soda in Bristol New Hampshire that the Dr. Pepper never tasted more sweet.

RD: You race so frequently, that your racing is probably your training or is it? What does a typical week of running look like for you?
Chuck: I try to do one speed day per week and one long run in the middle of the week. I also do my own version of plyos to maintain strength and flexibility. The week can be as high as 120 miles or as low as zero when I am decompressing. I like the 120 weeks better, but the zero weeks are needed from time to time. However, even during the zero weeks I will still try to bike or swim.

RD: I stress over and over to my running clients the importance of good nutrition to fuel their training effort. Do you have a favorite training food that you like to eat? Pre-run? Post-run?
Chuck: I love steel cut oatmeal with fresh blueberries and brown sugar for my pre-race meal. During the week its a lot of whole grain pastas and just a bit of chicken. But you gotta figure that during the weeks where I am putting in 120 miles I can eat pretty much anything. The book "Once A Runner" had a quote that said "If the furnace is hot enough, anything will burn." I say eat what you like and RUN MORE to burn it off.

RD: Are you a lone runner or do you run with some buddies? What do you like about each?
Chuck: I run alone. When I do run with others I tend to get into a racing mentality and that can destroy a weekly training regimen.

RD: What’s the funniest or oddest thing that’s happened to you while on a run?
Chuck: There was a race in the Pacific Northwest that I decided to make a quick stop in the woods. It's a pretty crazy story. I still won the race. It was, however, the slowest winning time in that particular race's history. Didn't bother me in the least.

RD: You mentioned that Nike has been your running shoe of choice? Why?
Chuck: My shoes have been and will always be NIKE! I love the Vomero 5 for training and the Lunars for racing. They just work for my feet. Nikes always have worked for me. I encourage any runner to find the right shoes for their feet and not to wear what the latest gold medalist is wearing.

RD: Tell us something about you that might surprise us. Bake? Sew? Sing karaoke?
Chuck: I do cook a lot. I love to cook. I even sing....when no one is around. I am a pretty simple runner. I think I am down to earth most of the time. I just have an unusual addiction to the pain found at or near the finish line of a marathon. It's just a beautiful thing.

RD: If you were speaking to a group of non-runners or runner wannabes and trying to encourage them to run, what would you say?
Chuck: One mile at a time. Most runner wannabes look at the whole cheesecake and eat it with their eyes. I tackle it one slice at a time. You can finish it if you start with one piece and don't think about the next piece until you are ready for the next piece. Any race really is just preparing your mind for one mile.....and then the next.

RD: You've accomplished so much in the past 10 years since that first marathon. What's next for the MarathonJunkie?
Chuck: I have a few goals. I would like to run another 200 sub 3 hour marathons before I hang up the shoes. I would like to win 50 more. But I will be happy just running and running more.

RunnerDude Chats with Ultra-Endurance Athlete Toby Guillette

I've run marathons for years, but one distance that has eluded me to this point is the ultra-endurance run. I envy runners that endure such long distances and often in very challenging locations. One such athlete that I've been following on Twitter and Facebook is Toby Guillette. Based in San Diego, Toby is an ultra-endurance athlete, outdoor-adventure blogger and social media specialist for the Active Network.  

What I like about Toby is that even though he's an ultra-endurance athlete he's also an expert on running for the beginner audience. His syndicated blog appeals to everyone.  He has written product, book and race reviews for the Active Network, where he is currently employed as a social media specialist. He has been featured in interviews on AmateurEndurance.com, the Triathlon Club of San Diego monthly newsletter and is establishing himself as a sponsored ultra-endurance athlete. Toby didn't start running until the age of 23. In the short time since his entry in to the world of running has raced at nearly every competitive distance and completed eight ultra marathons, including two 100-mile ultra marathons and a full iron-distance triathlon. Most recently he just completed the Grand Canyon Rim to Rim to Rim run which is about a 50-mile double crossing of the Grand Canyon from the South Rim in Arizona to the North Rim in Colorado and back, in about 15 hours.

Read on to learn more about this amazing young man....

RD: I believe you were born in my neck of the woods (Durham, NC), but shortly after, your family moved to Massachusetts. I see you’re now based in San Diego. I ran the Rock-n-Roll Marathon in San Diego several years ago. It’s a beautiful city. What brought you to the west coast?
TOBY: You got it! I relocated to San Diego after earning a degree in Sociology from George Washington University in D.C. My plan was to work at REI until my PeaceCorp application processed, but I fell in love with the west and have since both found and created myself here.

RD: You’re an Ultra-endurance athlete, outdoor-adventure blogger and social media expert. That’s quite a diverse load on your plate. Share a little about each and how you manage to wrap it all into (I must admit) an envious career.
TOBY: I’ve always been an athlete and I share my adventures with all my family and friends via the web. Since my brain is completely wired for social networking, an Internet-based career has been the natural path. Now I work at the Active Network where I have been able to fuse all of my passions into an exciting career in social media marketing.

RD: You must be unbelievably busy. When you do have free time, how do you spend it?
TOBY: I keep a full schedule with work, training and social life. It takes a lot of planning to fit it all in, but I’m at my best when challenged to balance it all. In my free time I coach endurance athletes, take lots of photos, enjoy craft beer, watch movies and plan fun adventures with my friends.

RD: You started running at age 23. What got into it?
TOBY: My brother encouraged me to train for the Rock ‘n’ Roll Marathon with him. I’ve always been inspired by him so I dove right into training and ramped up too soon. I ended up with really bad Achilles Tendonitis from training and couldn’t run the race with him. I could barely walk. So I became fascinated with figuring out what I did wrong and ended up cracking the code on my potential as an endurance runner. One year later I ran the San Diego 100 Mile Endurance Run, during which my brother paced me for over 15 miles through the night.

RD: Had you been a sports oriented kid? Did you grow up in a sports oriented family?
TOBY: It seems like my brother and I played every sport, but it all started with competitive swimming and then baseball. Our parents have always been supportive. We even had our own batting cage in our backyard. We both played a lot of soccer too and had a record-setting high school soccer season my senior year of prep school. I learned the value of hard work early on and have leveraged it to really take my running to a new level.

RD: What do you enjoy most about running? Is it the mental? Physical? Both?
TOBY: I enjoy the daily and annual structure of training, the goal setting process, the health benefits and the amazing people and places I’ve discovered along the way. Most of all, it’s helped me become a more positive and productive member of society.

RD: Do you ever get burned out with training? If so, share some of your strategies for pulling yourself out of a training funk.
TOBY: I’ve learned to set my year up to peak with a couple key events. Plus, I try and have a break in the summer and the winter for rest, too. But most of all, cross training helps me keep things interesting. Any given week I may run five times but I’ll also fit in a session or two of rock climbing, mountain biking, swimming, yoga and functional strength training. This typically helps me avoid injury and burn out.

RD:  Do you have a favorite training food? What other favorite foods do you include in your training? Do you ever concoct your own training recipes?
TOBY: My body does best on a healthy diet of fruits, vegetables, meat and as gluten-free as possible. But if I could fuel on only burritos and craft beer I definitely would!

RD: Are you a lone runner or do you run with some buddies? What do you like about each?

TOBY: It depends where in the season I am and how many runs per week I’m doing but I try to be as social as possible with my training. Last month I ran with over 30 different people. Sometimes it’s just more efficient to knock out the weekday stuff solo to get it done if I have something else on my schedule.

RD: What’s the funniest or oddest thing that’s happened to you while on a run?

TOBY: I was on a night run in a canyon when I saw two sets of big glowing eyes in the bushes staring back at me. Needless to say I had a near record-setting pace that night! Wasn’t too funny when it was happening but I can’t help but laugh about it now.

RD: What’s your biggest running accomplishment? Why?

TOBY: My most memorable running experience was the 2009 Vermont 100 Mile Endurance Run where I ran to a sub-22 hour finish with my family as my race crew. That was a very proud day for all of us.

RD: Do you have a favorite brand of running shoe? Which model? Why?

TOBY: I run in Brooks Glycerin with Superfeet insoles and GreenLaces from Yankz with Injinji toe-socks. I may have lost a few toenails in longer races, but I’ve never had blisters wearing this combination.

RD: What’s your favorite race distance(s)? Do you have a favorite race you run each year?

TOBY: I’ve raced nearly every competitive distance in both running and triathlon and have yet to discover my favorite distance. I do really enjoy 50K ultras because there are plenty of events to choose from, they are typically in beautiful off-road locations on very challenging terrain and there is still the rest of the day left after the race.

RD: What’s the craziest event you’ve done that after you started, you thought, “What the hell was I thinking?”
TOBY: My first 50-mile run was the hardest thing I’ve ever endured. I’ve never been more destroyed. Not even running 100’s. It didn’t hit me until the half-way mark when I started to cramp up and it all went downhill. It revealed a side of me I had never met before. I learned so much that day.

RD: You’ve got some pretty awesome runs coming up in the near future—the Grand Canyon Rim-to-Rim-to-Rim run in November and the Coastal Challenge Rain forest Expedition Run in January 2011. I am ENVIOUS!!!! The Green-Eyed Monster is sitting on my shoulder right now. Share a little about each race.

TOBY: I’m heading out to run the Grand Canyon this weekend so by the time you read this I’ll have attempted the rim-to-rim-to-rim run which is a 46-mile double crossing of the canyon. It’s a classic adventure run that three of my buddies and I have been planning for the past few months. Check out my site for the recap! (Toby and his team finished the run in about 15 hrs. Congrats, Toby!)

I’ve recently chosen not to run the Coastal Challenge in January because I’ll be on the east coast for half of December in family and holiday mode. There are just so many rad events that sometimes it’s tough to prioritize. But I have a couple epics in the mix for the 2011 season so stay tuned!

RD: One of the most appealing things about your blog is that even though you travel all over running these amazing and exotic races, you write to inspire the everyday and/or new runner. I’ve always felt that running is an inclusive sport and you definitely help support my theory. Why do you feel it’s important to stay connected to the everyday runner?

TOBY: Running is my vehicle of choice for interacting with the world around me and most people respect running, even if they love it or hate it. I choose to share my adventures with others in hopes of inspiring anyone I can because I recognize that people need inspiration. I’m no different – I need it too. So if what I do inspires someone to push through that final mile of their training run or go out and give running a try then I am stoked!

RD: If you were speaking to a group of non-runners or runner wannabes and trying to encourage them to run, what would you say?

TOBY: I’d encourage them to choose an event that feels like it’s just beyond what they are capable of and follow a training plan to accomplish it. It’s a transformational process that needs to be experienced because the lessons learned apply to all walks of life.

RD: What tips would you give someone contemplating their first ultra run?

TOBY: Simulate race conditions as closely as possible through the training process. Become your race.

RD: Is there anything you else you'd like to share?

TOBY: Thanks so much to the RunnerDude for this opportunity to share my story with your audience! I really appreciate how you are helping so many people get active and enjoy it. 

RD: Thanks, Toby! Same to you man and good luck with your upcoming 2011 epics! Looking forward to finding out what you'll be up to.

Be sure to check out Toby's blog as well as his Facebook and Twitter pages. 

RunnerDude Chats With Bart Yasso, Sarah Reinertsen, and Brian Boyle

Back in the spring, I had the awesome opportunity to interview Bart Yasso, Chief Running Officer at Runner's World, about his new book, My Life on the Run as well as his quest for Comrades. During that interview, he mentioned two athletes that were inspirations of his own—Sarah Reinertsen, and Brian Boyle. In addition to Bart, both Sarah and Brian were inspirations in my own life as well. I had followed their personal and professional stories over the past few years.

Sarah was born with a congenital birth defect and at the age of 7, her leg was amputated. This didn't stop Sarah though. As a teenager, she began to break all kinds of records and set firsts for female above-the-knee amputees including being the first female leg amputee to complete the Ironman World Championship in Hawaii. Sarah tells her story in her autobiography, In a Single Bound: Losing My Leg, Finding Myself, and Training for Life. My daughter and I fell in love with Sarah and her story while watching the reality show The Amazing Race back in 2006 in which she was a contestant.

About a year before Sarah's conquering of the Hawaii Ironman, 18-year-old Brain Boyle was the victim of a horrific car crash in which a dump truck crushed him and his car. Brain was in a medically induced comma for 2 months. He lost 60% of his blood. His heart suffered horrific trauma, and his internal organs and pelvis also received devastating damage. During his recovery period, he lost 100lbs. Even though doctors thought he'd never walk again, Brian fought back with superhuman and unbelievable determination. Not only did he recover, he became an Ironman when he completed the 2007 Hawaii Ironman in Kona. You can read about the accident and Brian's comeback in his autobiography Iron Heart: The True Story of How I Came Back From the Dead.

After the interview with Bart, I got to thinking how great it would be to do an interview with Sarah and one with Brian for blog. So, I emailed Bart to see if he had any contact information for Sarah and Brian. Bart immediately said, "Yes!" But, Bart had an even better idea. Bart said, "I'd love to talk with Sarah and Brian too. What do you think about all four of us talking at the same time?" Excited to no end, I said, "Great idea!" Bart checked it out with Sarah and Brian and before I knew it, I was contacting everyone setting up the conference call.

Thanks, Bart for such a great idea! And thanks to Sarah, Brian, and Bart for taking the time to talk with RunnerDude and share their stories with the blog readers. You guys rock!

In the introduction to Bart's book, he says, "Running may be the connective tissue, but the true experience of the sport is a passage to a bigger world. So open the door and run through. Just don't be surprised if you arrive in a place you only dreamed existed." That's how I felt talking with Bart, Sarah, and Brian during the interview. Below is our conversation.

Bart: Okay Thad, you’re in charge buddy. Where do you what to go from here?

RD: Well, I do have some questions that I want to be sure and ask each of you, but with the four of us on the call, it would be great to just have a rich conversation and a good dialogue. If you guys have questions for each other or want to interject a comment at any time, please feel free to do so.

I wanted to start off by saying that I’ve read all three of your books, Bart’s My Life on the Run: Wit, Wisdom, and Insights of a Road Racing Icon, Sarah’s In a Single Bound: Losing My Leg, Finding Myself, and Training for Life, and Brian’s Iron Heart: The True Story of How I Came Back From the Dead. All of them were amazing books to read and so inspirational. I was diagnosed with Ulcerative Colitis about 10 years ago and had a related surgery about 7 years ago and I used running to help me recover and get back into life. So, on some levels, I could relate to parts of your stories of overcoming struggles that life presents you. It meant a lot to read about how each of you dealt with your own unique struggles with life, health, and running and how you each overcame your life adversities to go on to accomplish such great things. Bart, your running over 1000 races and just recently running Comrades in Africa. Sarah, your setting all kinds of firsts and records for female amputees. Brian, I mean you literally came back from the dead to run your first Ironman and then go on to be competitive in so many more endurance events. So, thank each of you for sharing your stories.

It seems like each of you has this innate determination or lack of a better word “gumption” to live life to the fullest. I’d like each of you to speak to this. Where did it come from? Were you born with it? Did you get it from your parents or family? Was it cultivated over time?

BART: Who wants to go first? I always say, “Ladies first.” So Sarah, go for it.

SARAH: Yes, I’ll start, I know my family was a big part of it for sure in me finding my own independence and really encouraging me to find my own strength. They supported me to push myself beyond the limits. So for sure my parents played a big part. My mom was quoted in the Ironman interview and shared the story other times about when I’d fall down at the playground. She’d make me get up on my own. The other mothers thought that was cruel for her to make her one-legged daughter get up on her own, but she was helping me learn to be self-sufficient and independent. That was an important lesson for me to learn for sure.

RD: How about you, Brian?

BRIAN: I would say just like Sarah said, "Family first." I mean my parents were there all my life supporting me all the way through athletics and academics. I grew up with a very positive attitude and was very outgoing and very determined, so when the accident happened, it just went into overdrive. I was still kind of the same person; just more driven. Kind of driven to get back into life again. To walk. To jog. To swim. To ride again. Just to do everything I used to do. Having the support of my parents was a Godsend. And then to come back the way I did and then do all the races was just a wonderful thing to cross the finish line. It was like a big thank you to my parents and everyone who helped in my recovery. It’s a constant show of appreciation to everyone who has helped me in my journey.

RD: I think you mention on your website how all the nurses, technicians, medical staff and others at all the various hospitals and rehabilitation centers you stayed in were like family and played an important part in your recovery too.

BRIAN: Definitely. Everyone from the hospital to the rehab center to the outpatient rehab center gave so much support. The Ironman was a way of saying, “This is what you’ve done for me. Thank you.” That was a big day for me back in 2007.

RD: How about you Bart?

BART: Yeah, you know my mother and my brother George where truly the guiding lights in my life. My older brother was more of a father figure than a brother to me. He was a great teacher even though he wasn’t a teacher by profession. He was a financial analyst, but he was a great teacher. He knew what to give me. He gave me enough to get me going then made me do the work. I think of my mom as always there for me. My guiding light. You know my mom and brother aren’t with us any longer, so I rely on people like Sarah and Brian as my sources of inspiration and as mentors. I talk about them all the time in my shows. If you have this gift, this passion and then you have this story, you have to go out and share your story with others with great enthusiasm to motivate and inspire others no matter their situations.

RD: Sarah, I just wanted to let you know that one of your biggest fans is my 15-year-old daughter. We’re both big fans of the reality show The Amazing Race and she first became familiar with you and your story when you were a contestant in the race. She loves it when girls are just as gutsy and competitive as the guys and you were that and then some in that race. She thought you were awesome and it actually helped inspire her to eventually take up running. She just recently finished one of my beginning running programs. That provided us with a really unique bonding experience.

SARAH: Thanks, that’s one of my big missions as an athlete and role model is to mentor. Bart’s actually one of my mentors and inspirations and like he mentioned earlier, it’s important to help inspire others to get active and get into the sport, so I’m really tickled that your daughter was moved by The Amazing Race to get into running. Thanks for sharing that with me.

RD: Brian, are there any mentors you’ve look to for inspiration over the years?

BRIAN: I would definitely say going back before the Ironman, just growing up and watching the Ironman as a kid and watching the athletes compete and then seeing Sarah’s journey two years in a row and seeing the determination it took to get to the bike course to finish that race. As an inspiring Ironman, that was my determination just to be there and feel that Ironman spirit. And to do that and then be accepted into the marathon community and meet people like Bart has been awesome. Just doing each race is a journey in itself. You meet so many inspirational people like Sarah and getting to talk to Bart Yasso over the past year has been tremendous.

RD: I thought it was cool that both you and Sarah did the Hawaii Ironman in Kona. Did Sarah’s journey inspire you to run the same Ironman?

BRIAN: Growing up I just wanted to do an Ironman. It could have been any of the Ironman races, but to go in and run Hawaii is like completing the Ironman of Ironmans.

RD: It’s funny how life sometimes provides moments, events, encounters that can end up having such a profound impact on our lives. Sarah, I know in your book you talk about meeting a lady, Paddy Rossbach, who first planted the seed that you could run marathons. I think you were pretty young, maybe around 6th grade.

SARAH: Yeah, Paddy is a runner who runs on a prosthetic leg. Backing up, my dad was a runner. He was a Runner’s World subscriber. He'd often take me to races. This was the first race, however, where I saw someone running on a prosthetic leg in the same race as my dad. Seeing Paddy run opened up a whole new reality that if she could do it on a prosthetic leg then I could do it to. You know that really completely changed my life. I started meeting with physical therapists who taught me how to run. And like my dad, I clipped out articles from Runner’s World magazine and eventually started using their 5K and 10K training plans and you know got myself in all these races. It started this whole new passion in my life that's lasted over 20 years now. So, I owe a lot to Paddy Rossbach for sure.

RD: Brian and Bart, did either of you have some type of event like Sarah’s that sort of got the ball rolling for your interest in running?

BART: Yeah, there was a guy who was a few years older than me that went to the same school I was going to. I used to see him running every morning. And at one point I was jealous of seeing this guy running every morning. And when I got into running 33 years ago he was the gentleman that inspired me. I thought I had to get out there every morning at 5:30AM and run like this dude. He really inspired me.

RD: That’s cool Bart. So, if this older student hadn’t been a runner, no telling what you’d be doing now. Hey Brain, what about you?

BRIAN: Early on in my athletic career in High School I started swimming competitively on the high school swim team. Before this my background had been basketball, shot put, discus, track, but no distance. When I switched over to swimming my sophomore year in high school, I really didn’t know the competitive strokes. I swam in some summer programs but that was more for fun. One of the upper classmen, Ethan Ratliff, (he was a senior and I was a sophomore) took me under his wing and showed me the ropes, kept me in the loop, and helped me perfect my swimming performance and racing abilities. The fact that I had an older guy believe in me (I was new to the team and he was “the King” of the swim team and state champion in Maryland) to be in that limelight with him was pretty overwhelming for me in such a positive manner. A few months went by and I was able to train and get better and get really, really good at the sport. I think in the first year near the end of the year, there was a state championship and he picked me to be on his relay team and we got a state championship medal which was tremendous for me in my athletic career so as an athlete that was a big thing for me.

RD: Sarah, in your book you talk about the gift of being different and you talk about how hard it was to fit in as a youngster in different situations. I wondered if you could speak to kids today who find themselves in similar situations by sharing what helped you persevere and get through those tough times.

SARAH: I have to give a lot of credit to sports for really making me feel comfortable in my skin and whole in my body when I did feel so different. I think a lot of teenagers, even if they’re not disabled, all go through some experience of feeling different. I was just lucky to find the outlet of sports and go to the track and sweat it out and turn those bad days into good days and kind of leave all the teasing and tormenting aside. Sports really helped me find that. I think you’ve got to rock what you’ve got. I truly do believe that what makes us unique is what makes us beautiful. Part of the human experience is that we all bring this unique point of view and I’m glad I have that, but that’s hard for teenagers to see.

RD: Yeah, I just read a report that said that one out of every six kids are bullied in some way, so I think it’s great for kids to hear your message that we should celebrate out differences and find our unique outlets whether it's sports, or the arts, or whatever.

RD: A lot of people, especially non-runners think of running just as a means of exercise and staying fit, but for me it’s so much more. It’s part of what keeps me sane. Can any of you imagine life without running? What would it be like without it?

BART: Wow, I’ve never been asked that question. But you know, I can barely run these days. I run literally like 1/100 what I used to run, but I feel very lucky that I still work in the sport and through Runner’s World I can still stay connected to people through running. I don’t know…there are so many things to gravitate to in life. I just think that if I can’t run that I’ll gravitate to something that's going to make me just as happy and still keep me connected to people. I just think you have this type of personality that you have and you go wherever it’s going to lead you.

SARAH: Well, Bart’s modest about saying he doesn’t run much, but I know he manages to squeeze in miles here and there and he pushes himself even though he has Lyme disease which is hard on his joints and makes it not the easiest thing to run these days. He still bikes and I know he gets out there and hammers and he does find some activity to get his heart pumping. I think we all have that common thread of knowing that sports helps us feel alive and if we find we can’t run some day, we’ll bike. And if we can’t bike, we’ll swim. And if I can’t swim, well I don’t know, maybe I’ll take up watercolor painting, just something (laughing) that keeps me active and makes me feel passionate and keeps me as an observer in the world.

BART: I totally agree with what Sarah’s said.

RD: How about you Brian?

BRIAN: Definitely agree with what Sarah’s said. That’s the perfect answer there (laughing).

RD: I’ve had the privilege to work with all ages and abilities of runners, but one of my groups that I find the most inspirational are the beginning running groups. Not always, but often the group ends up being comprised of individuals coming to the sport for the first time as older adults in their 40s, 50s, and 60s. Most of them are very concerned about how they’re going to stack up to the others in the group. Will they be the least fit? The slowest? The oldest? The funny thing is that they have no idea that every one of them is thinking the exact same thing. What’s so cool is to see these very hesitant runners progress over time. Seeing them gain physical strength and muscular and aerobic endurance is awesome. Even more awesome is seeing them become more confident. More than physical constraints, lack of confidence is what often holds individuals back from becoming more active, especially as older adults. How do you guys feel about the importance of staying active throughout your life to maintain a good quality of life and how do you share that with others? Sarah and Brian you guys are both still youngsters, but Bart….? (Chuckling)

BART: Yep, I’m just about ready to turn 55 in a couple of weeks…yeah; I meet people of all ages getting into running and triathlons. I’m just happy people got to the sport. The great thing about running is that we do include everyone. We don’t turn anyone away. If people would just get to a race, they’d understand that they’d fit in. The hard part is getting them to take those first couple of steps to run and then enter an event, because it is intimidating. Everyone does think that all the runners run as fast as Ryan Hall and Carl Lewis and that’s just not the case when you go to a local 5K. But that’s someone’s perception and when they go out and run they know they’re not that fast so they just suppress their feelings that they should be out there. But, once they get out there, someone can convince them into trying and taking those first steps, then they are hooked. Then they feel a part of something. That’s what I love. I want to keep doing this for another ….I don’t know how long I’ll be at Runner’s World, but you know, I hope to work here a few more years and then I hope to keep this passion going that I have of connecting with people through running for a long time.

RD: There’s a lot of research I’ve read recently that says this is the first generation of kids whose life expectancy is shorter than that of their parents. There are so many contributing factors to this like kids living more sedentary lives, schools reducing or taking out physical education and/or recess, kids being engrossed in television and/or computer games, non-stop texting, families no longer eating together and/or eating more fast-food or prepackaged meals. All of this is causing the childhood obesity rate to skyrocket. What do you think is a solution? I see running playing a part in the solution, but what are your thoughts?

BART: Go ahead Brian; you’re still a kid in my eyes. (Brain chuckling) I mean you’re still in school.

BRIAN: I’d say it’s a pretty tough call. For many people my age and in high school, video games are a big factor. When you’re not in class, a lot of your time is spent playing these games. I think it’s an escape for some stress-free time, which is good, but if you’re not careful it can consume more time than you realize and that’s an unfortunate thing. Not all kids get caught up in that cycle. I was one of the rare few and I still am. You know I just preferred to go and be outdoors not ever indoors. I had enough of that being in the hospital. I’d much rather be walking, jogging, hiking, running…anything. There’s so much more to that. The endorphins are going. You go out in an Ironman, marathon or any kind of race or event and there's so much more. It’s a social gathering. It’s a way of being in an environment where everyone is supporting each other. It’s like another family in a way. I think if young people in high school or college get out there and experience that feeling of being active and belonging, they’ll want that more and more.

RD: Yep, I couldn’t agree more. For the younger kids, it’s providing those opportunities for kids to experience being active especially being active in group situations. Last year I had the privilege of being on the board of a non-profit called GO FAR which stands for Go Out For A Run. This organization provides a 10-week program that trains 3rd, 4th, 5th, and 6th graders to run their first 5K. It also includes learning about good nutrition and character building. The kids culminate the program by running a 5K set up especially for them, their coaches, and families. I attended the spring GO FAR 5K and there were close to 1000 kids running. It was an amazing sight to see.

RD: On a different topic, what do you guys think about the Boston controversy with the registration filling up so quickly? Some think the qualification requirements need to be changed for everyone. Others think the women’s qualifying times need to be reconfigured. What is your take on the issue?

SARAH: Well, I don’t know that much about it, but you know running and racing in general is getting more and more popular and races are seeing the effects of this. As more people get active and run, then just naturally more people are going to qualify. The city has to put a cap on it. I’m certainly not going to tell Boston how they should do things.

BART: I can certainly touch on it. I communicate quite a bit with Dave McGillivray, the race director of the Boston Marathon and um it did sell out in what, something like 9hours and I thought it would because of this backlog of people that didn’t get in. I do feel sorry for some of the people who tried to get on in the morning and there were some server issues or computer problems. But, you know, this has been going on in Ironman races for years (Sarah and Brian in unison, “Exactly!”). They physically go to the races and sign up at the race because it’s the only way to get in. A lot of times there’s only a three-hour window where you can get in online. It’s just a part of the deal. If you’re that passionate about doing it, then you got to do it.

SARAH: I guess that’s why, when I heard “9 hours!” it seemed pretty….

BART: Seem pretty lenient, huh?

SARAH: Yeah! (laughing)

RD: So you’re wondering why they’re whining.

BART: Well, it’s news about the marathon so I understand and people got caught off guard. But, I’ve been telling people for months how fast Boston was going to sell out. If you’re passionate about doing it, you have to commit and do it. That’s all there is to it. You can’t waiver. You enter and that’s it. There’s no sitting on the fence. You know the Boston Marathon people are obligated to the seven municipalities that the race runs through that they’ll only have 25,000 runners. It’s up to the marathon if they want to toughen the standards. When I ran Boston back in the day when I was a young guy, you had to run a 2:50:00 and that was the standard. We knew that and we worked for that. Honestly, I do hope they toughen the standards, but I don’t know about making it tougher for women than men. I don’t agree with that. I think they should leave the older age group times alone because there’s not a lot of people in those age groups, but toughen up the open standard because those people are young and fit and they can run these faster times. They’ll just have to do the work. If Boston sets the bar higher, they’ll just have to for it. I think it would help runners in the US, if they toughen the standards, specifically on the open men’s side and women’s side.

RD: Brain, what are your thoughts?

BRIAN: I’m just hoping to get to Boston, first…. (RunnerDude: “Me too.” [laughing]) One question I do have is, do the marathons after the registration period qualify you for the 2012 Boston? How does that work

BART: Yeah, so if you do Marine Corps or Philly and made your times, then you'd qualify for 2012.

BRIAN: Oh man, then I should have done Baltimore. I’m not even close, but I was curious how that whole process works.

RD: Yeah, I think there were a lot of runners qualified that didn’t make it before the registration closed. Those were the ones who were speaking out the loudest, but that's just the nature of the beast. Good or bad.

BART: And honest Thad, I think for a couple of people it will change their mindset that they thought they always had to do Boston every year because they qualified. They’ll pick another race like London or Big Sur and they may find that they like these smaller marathons or ones more exotic locations. For some people it will be a blessing in disguise, but they’re going to have to find their way and see how they feel about it.

RD: Earlier today, I spoke with Matt Fitzgerald; he’s the senior editor at Triathlete magazine and the author of Run: The Mind-Body Method of Running by Feel. The book talks about how the brain really is what’s in charge of your training not a plan. It details the importance of knowing your own body and its limitations, but also what’s possible beyond the boundaries, how hard to push yourself, and when to rest. I was wondering how that or if that played a part in your training. Do you have a plan you follow? How much to rely on feel

SARAH: I’ll just say briefly, I haven’t read Matt’s book, but when you were just describing it, my immediate thoughts were that I’m definitely a plan person and I like to look at a training schedule and if it says to run that much I’ll do it. I like to have that to follow; however, I have medical considerations that I have to think about. So, definitely sometimes when I’m out there and my prosthetic leg is rubbing and it’s going to put a sore on my stump, I’m like, “you know I’m not going to push it” because then I’ll have a worse sore on my stump and then I have to recover and then I can’t run as much. So, I definitely know my own mind-body connection and I know what I can and cannot push it to and I think that’s just something that you learn over time. Anyone who has a medical consideration kind of finds those parameters.

RD: And they probably find those parameters sooner than runners without medical conditions. Sometimes I think the average runner finds themselves in trouble because they do stick so rigidly to the plan and don’t realize they have some input in their training. Sometimes the body needs to rest while other times it might be ready to go beyond what’s slated for the day. Matt mentioned that many of African runners he’s spoken with think American’s tend to over-think running. Instead of running more by feel, we tend to have to run a certain distance at a certain pace on a certain day. The book is enlightening in that it frees up the runner, not to toss the plan, but to just be liberated to not feel guilty if he alters the plan based on where he’s at mentally or physically each day.

SARAH: Yeah, sometimes I love to run a race without a watch. I think that’s a great way to tap into that whole running by feel. Don’t worry about the time, just run based on how you feel that day.

RD: Yep, in fact a good friend of mine Dena Harris just did that very same thing in a local half marathon and ended up with an awesome time.

SARAH: Well, and especially since you have the chip timing. You’re paying for that service and you’re going to get a split, so it’s like free yourself from that labor of checking the watch.

RD: How about you Brian?

BRIAN: I try to get an overall plan set up for the season and I do my best to try to stick to it, but with my accident, I lost a lot of organs and the organs that were affected still cause a lot of medical problems now. So, if I know I have a hard week, I try my best to stick to the plan, but if I get sick or get bronchitis then I’ll have to adjust the schedule to work around it. Like Sarah said, you know the part of the race that’s the best for me is the experience of it. A lot of races I just run to be in the experience and be with the other runners and enjoy the sights. You just feel it…physically…emotionally…psychologically...every way possible. To me that’s so much better than crossing the finish line and setting a personal best. When you race a lot, you can’t always get a personal best so you’ve got to go out there and just enjoy it too.

RD: I know, Bart, you said that even though you’re running a lot slower than you did years ago that you still get that thrill of crossing the finish line each time.

BART: Yeah, you know prior to Comrades, I did 10 marathons in like a 21-week period and a lot of times my time was 2 hours slower than what I used to do, but the thrill was still there. And it wasn’t that I just was running 2 hours slower. I was physically running what my body would allow me to run. What I discovered and what made me happy was that I was surrounded by a lot more runners than I was used to, and these runners liked to communicate and encourage you and I could do the same to them. I didn’t have that in my other running life, so it was eye-opening in many ways and absolutely a wonderful experience.

RD: A lot of the runners I work with are in their 40s, 50s, and 60s and many of them will come to me saying, “You know I’m not running like I used to. I’m fatiguing sooner.” They often think it’s just related to getting older, but I’ve found that it has more to do with having a weak core and upper-body. As we age, we tend to be involved less in activities that would naturally strengthen the core and upper body. So, if a person is just running to keep fit, they’re getting a great leg workout and aerobic workout, but the upper-body is being neglected. The Core is the power source for a runner and a strong upper-body helps maintain good running form. It’s kind of a domino effect. If the good running form goes, then more stress is put on the core that in turn puts more stress on the lower-body and then before you know it, you’re fatigued and slowing down. I’m a big advocate of full-body strength, especially focusing on the core and upper-body shooting for muscular endurance to help maintain good running form, but also to help increase stability, balance and flexibility for everyday life. Do you guys incorporate that into your training

BART: Brian was a body builder at one point, right Brian? (Brian laughing) My wife was in love with Brian. He’s got long hair. I have no hair. (Everyone laughing) He’s got muscles. I have no muscle. He’s young and good looking and well, I’m neither. So my wife always loves to be around Brian. I believe (and you can speak to this, Brian) the reason why Brian survived his accident was that he had body mass. When you lost over 100lbs you were still strong enough to survive.

BRIAN: Yes sir. Yes sir. Back during the accident recovery, I remember hearing the doctors saying that if I hadn't had all that muscle mass and been in such good physical health, that I wouldn’t have survived. My heart would have stopped beating and everything would have just shut down. I wouldn’t have been able to have pushed through those two months of being comatose. A lot of my program now involves cross-training--swim, bike, run--weights, core work (abs, planks). Planks are really tough and frustrating, but they have a really great benefit to them (Bart agreeing in the background). A lot of medicine ball work. Having the background with power lifting and body building helps, but it also has its affects because I was built like a linebacker. You know I don’t have the best running form, but I’m out there just doing what I got to do. Trying my best.

RD: That’s great. I think a lot of runners have a fear of doing resistance training and lifting weights because they’re picturing a bodybuilder physique and they’re hesitant thinking if they lift weights they’ll add bulk which will slow them down. Unfortunately many don’t see and miss out on all the benefits of working the core and full body conditioning geared more for muscular endurance rather than strength. Great hearing you and Bart talk about using other methods in your training in addition to the aerobic workouts.

BART: Core strength is really vital, when you mentioned being in your 50s, because you have to keep a good posture during running and that really comes from your core. As you get older, people tend to slouch more not only in the shoulders, but they'll lean more from the waist and that’s not good in running. I work on core strength all the time. In the Comrades piece in the current Runner’s World, I had to bring in all these old running photos of me. They wanted kind of a history of me running from college till now. So, I brought this tub of photos and gave it to the photo editors and they kept saying, “Oh my god, you had these ripped abs" and all this stuff. I don’t have those abs any more, they’re covered up with 15-20lbs I put on when I cut back on my running, but I still have core strength. I just don’t have the 6-pack Men’s Health ab thing, but I still feel like I have good core strength and I work on that at our gym. We are very fortunate here at Rodale to have our own fitness center and it’s convenient. I go there at least 2-3 times a week.

RD: That’s great. Sarah, how about you? How do you incorporate other types of training into your plan?

SARAH: You know, I was going to say as well that weight training is important, especially for women for prevention of osteoporosis. I do hit the gym. Sometimes I’m not as consistent about it. I don’t really like being indoors that much, but I do workout. I've also practiced a lot of yoga the past 13 years, not that yoga is necessarily the same exact thing, but I do think it helps work on my core and it’s helped me to stretch as well as other things that have helped me as an athlete.

BART: Sarah’s totally ripped! She’s got legs and arms like I wish I had. She works it. And, plus Sarah, I would assume that your non-prosthetic leg does so much work, that you just use it nonstop.

SARAH: Yeah, I’m actually doing exercises to strengthen other parts of my body to help prevent getting injuries because I know that I’m going to be demanding so much of that leg for the rest of my life…just to live, not just to run a race.

RD: This has been great. I wish we had the time to talk for the rest of the day. I’ve learned so much more about each of you as athletes and individuals. So thank you for sharing yourselves with the readers of RunnerDude’s Blog. I wanted to end by asking what’s next on the horizon for each of you.

BART: Go Sarah. You start us off.

SARAH: Yeah, let’s save Bart for last, because he probably has the busiest schedule ahead. I’m going to be at Rocket City Marathon in December. I’m also doing the half-marathon at Rock-n-Roll Vegas and Muddy Buddy in a couple of weeks and that’s about it for the rest of this season of 2010.

RD: Hey Brian, what about you?

BRIAN: I’m actually packing today (10/27) to do Ironman Florida next week (11/5). Then the following week I have my first 50K. Then the next week is the JFK 50-Miler. Then maybe 2 or 3 weeks after that is the Charlotte Marathon and that will be the end of 2010.

RD: Man, both of you have busy schedules ahead. The Charlotte Marathon, huh? Cool. That’s just a little less than 2 hours SW of me here in NC. I’m in Greensboro, more in the middle of the state.

BRIAN: Yeah, Thunder Road!

RD: Bart, your turn man.

BART: Yeah, I’ve got a few more events ahead this year. Nothing I’m going to run, but some I’m going to attend—NYC Marathon, Richmond Marathon, the Running Event in Austin Texas, the Barbados Marathon. And then I get into all these warm places in the month of December, January, and February because my wife is a California girl and doesn’t like winter in Pennsylvania and since we don’t have kids, we can travel, you know, through the winter. That’s what we do. We go to warm places and I find races in all the warm areas. But it never ends. I get speaking engagements during the week. I just feel so lucky I get to stay so connected to the sport through the speaking engagements and going to the events.

RD: Busy man. Busy man. I just wanted to thank each of you for taking the time to speak with me today and give us a little peak into your lives. I can’t thank you enough for sharing more about your stories and your sport and I know the readers of RunnerDude’s Blog will enjoy immensely getting to know more about each of you. Each of you in so many different ways has contributed so much to the sport as well as being such a source of inspiration to me and countless others across the country and the world. Keep doing what you’re doing.

BART: Thank you. Thank you for doing this and what you’re doing for the running community.

SARAH: Thanks!

BRIAN: Thanks very much.

BART: I say this all the time, that Brian and Sarah are the two greatest athletes I’ve ever encountered because to be a great athlete, not only do you have to be a great athlete in the athletic sense, but whatever you accomplish you have to share with everyone and have that passion to do that and these two do that better than anyone I’ve ever encountered.

RD: Thanks again and happy running!